Mark:
This post reads like something from DJ the troll.
We have an all volunteer military, and its numbers represent a miniscule percentage of the Canadian population. The decision to join the military (as well as the decision not to enlist) is entirely a personal choice, and one that should be made without fear of any societal judgment, especially on the basis of ethnicity.
I'm a white non-immigrant adult male, and I did not serve in the CF. The same can be said of probably 98% of my demographic. If I get a pass for not serving, then so should any immigrant of colour.
Enlistment of the visible ethnic minorities boils down to one thng....they do not consider themselves Canadian. The first generation may be born here, but they consider themselves whatever country of origin their parents are from.
Posted at 2007-08-28 19:33:15 [PermaLink]As always the leftards clearly focused on the non-existent ..... just because it's so important.
Posted at 2007-08-28 20:07:01 [PermaLink]Gee, Mike, "I'm a white non-immigrant adult male, and I did not serve in the CF." But then I'm an American and I did serve in the U.S. Army.
Seriously, I think you miss the point. No one should be forced to join the military, at least in peacetime, but the lack of ethnic minorities is an indictment of multiculturalism and the lack of assimilation into a common culture and a desire to help defend that culture.
For many immigrants, Canadian citizenship means little and is a flag of convenience -- for example, all those Canadian dual nationals living in Lebanon who demanded to be evacuated when a war broke out. [External Link]
If you want to find a small window, looking in on what was once the Canada of your forefathers, look to the demographics of the Canadian military.
English, Irish, Germanic stock, with a civic sense of pride and duty.That they remain the backbone of our nation is a credit to them, and god help us if we relied on multiculturalism to help fill the ranks in their absence.
I think it needs to be said that Ethnics not joining the military here do so with the understanding that they have no wish to fight against people of their own kind , in places they left because of the violence and strife.
They view Canada as a safe haven, nothing more, a land to be exploited and not served.
A curious lack of faith and love for ones new land, can only lead me to believe that they would just as soon turn their backs on us if the economic situation worsened...or if one day,God forbid we have armed conflict amongst our various ethnic groups.
These people must view the white boys as complete suckers, doing the dirty work of nation maintanence whilst they reap the benefits of a free society paid for with Canadian soldiers blood
They really have no idea that all they see, all they have was bought and paid for at a very high price, and as the saying goes, freedom ain't cheap.
That being said, if they don't want to come, i don't want them.We will get by..
As for Mark, who said you as a white able bodied male get's a free pass? not from me..i think all Canadians should be required to serve 2 years national service..
When did you serve, Bruce? Was it an all volunteer service, or was the draft still in place?
For most immigrants, Canadian citizenship means a great deal, and is not a "flag of convenience." Obviously, there are exceptions, but the vast majority of our immigrants have no intention of returning to their country of origin. I concede the point that some immigrant communities are extremely insular, however that has not precluded their members from being, for the most part, productive, contributing citizens of this country.
I don't see how this issue differs from the question of immigrants serving in emergency service professions (police, fire, paramedic). Immigrants are underrepresented in these vital services as well, but the "solution" causes a problem where no actual "problem" existed in the first place; these jobs need to be the exclusive domain of qualified individuals who want to do them. The ethnic origin of the person performing the task is meaningless in the case of fire and paramedic, and also meaningless for policing, beyond the advantages derived from policing one's own ethno-cultural entity.
The same goes for the Canadian Forces. The colour of its soldiers has no bearing on its performance. Further, our military is of a size where, as I pointed out earlier, 98% of white males won't serve, so how can anyone in good conscience condemn a lack of representation from visible minorities?
OMMAG, I'm about as far from a "lefttard" as you can get, in the event your nonsensical comment was directed at me.
"As for Mark, who said you as a white able bodied male get's a free pass? not from me..i think all Canadians should be required to serve 2 years national service.."
It's Mike, Kursk, and when you get to be Prime Minister some day, then you can draft my sorry ass. For the record, I didn't "avoid" military service. I seriously considered it, and my younger brother spent 8 years in the CF. I decided to do something else, because I simply wanted to do it more than I wanted to be a soldier. That's what people get to do in a democracy. No one in this country, whether collectively or individually, should be looked down upon for deciding to do whatever the hell they want as a career.
Well Mark, if i do become PM, have your card ready becasue i will draft your ass..:)
'The ethnic origin of the person performing the task is meaningless in the case of fire and paramedic, and also meaningless for policing, beyond the advantages derived from policing one's own ethno-cultural entity.'
Really? you do realise it has everything to do with race and standards..which would you rather have, a 6'4" 250lb guy..dragging you out of a fire or 5'2" Sri Lankan female placed in her position by govt mandate?
That is neither here nor there..i was many years in CAF and i have no time for shirkers..not nec. you, but others who come and take, and never give back..that irks me, and i really don't give a great goddamn if anybody doesn't like it..couldn't care less..part of the program or shut the hell up..
"When did you serve, Bruce? Was it an all volunteer service...?"
1978-81 - all volunteer. Serving in the military is also a long-established route to citizenship in the U.S., so there was no shortage of immigrants.
I don't mind immigrants. As with Canada, the U.S. is a nation of immigrants, and there is no shortage of hard-working people trying to get in or work for them to do once they get here. What I don't want to see is an opportunistic immigrant community with no loyalty and no sense of commitment to the nation as a whole.
"Really? you do realise it has everything to do with race and standards..which would you rather have, a 6'4" 250lb guy..dragging you out of a fire or 5'2" Sri Lankan female placed in her position by govt mandate?"
Why does the female in your example have to be an immigrant, Kursk? What difference does her ethnicity make? The absence of any ethnic identifier for the male firefighter demonstrates how spurious your example is.
"That is neither here nor there..i was many years in CAF and i have no time for shirkers..not nec. you, but others who come and take, and never give back.."
Well, why not "me," Kursk? That's my point. How do I qualify as a non-shirker, while the immigrant community, writ large, apparently deserves this tag, in your opinion?
There are immigrants who " come and take, and never give back...," just as there are those who are native born Canadians who are blots on our society, and could be described in exactly the same way: takers, not contributors. There's plenty of room for criticism when it comes to the way Canada handles immigration, and I consider myself one of the critics. But joining the military is, and should be, an intensely personal choice.
The other point that needs to be made is that visible minorities will gradually increase their representation in the CF through the passage of time. Each successive generation of Canada's immigrant community becomes more integrated and assimilated than the previous one.
And for the record, no demographic group has paid a higher price, in terms of percentage of Afghan mission deaths to their percentage of population, than Caribbean blacks.
"What I don't want to see is an opportunistic immigrant community with no loyalty and no sense of commitment to the nation as a whole."
I feel the same way, Bruce, and as I mentioned in my previous comment, Canada's immigration policy leaves a lot to be desired.
My perspective is certainly influenced by the fact that I live in a city of 40,000 people, rather than one of the highly populated urban metropolises. In my experience, integration is largely a non-issue in my community. My son's high school basketball team roster includes a Somali youth and a Jordanian youth. The two fit in seamlessly with their peers. They are Canadian, in every sense of the word. The Somali youth is one of my son's best friends. My city has numerous foreign born doctors practising here. I had an appointment with one yesterday.
I think the root of this discussion is the VISIBLE commitment of new Canadians to Canada. Personally, I really don't care if they don't opt for serving in the CF or emergency services. I have to say that my experience with new Chinese immigrants, met through my daughter's schooling, here in Vancouver, was very positive. They bent over backwards to help out and participate; their kids were integrated quickly into the schools social scene.
Man, I'm there with the 250lb Fireguy carrying my 190 lb sorry ass down a four story ladder!!! Forget the ethnic quota b.s....
Well the Caribean Blacks are probably going to Afghanistan to imrove their shooting skills, so they can continue shooting each other back here in Canada.
Posted at 2007-09-01 04:34:33 [PermaLink]